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	<title>Comments on: How a Bad Expert Witness Can Ruin A Case</title>
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	<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case</link>
	<description>Perry v. Schwarzenegger: Tracking the right-wing</description>
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		<title>By: Skemono</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206219</link>
		<dc:creator>Skemono</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 23:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206219</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Many of us well-educated agnostics quite rationally believe that the definition of marriage should not be changed.&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Well, let&#039;s see what your &quot;quite rational&quot; rationales are. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;we think that children have a right to know and live with their biological parents&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Which is why those same people are also against divorce and remarrying, adoption, foster homes, artificial insemination, and surrogate mothers for opposite-sex couples, right? 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s a matter of common sense that men and women are designed to be together and procreate&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Hence infertile opposite-sex couples aren&#039;t allowed to marry.  And of course the use of &quot;common sense&quot; in lieu of facts, studies, well-reasoned arguments... yeah!  You&#039;re certainly showing us snobby elites how smart you are. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s based on personal experience of growing up in a traditional family&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
I... I can&#039;t even figure out the supposed rationale here.  &quot;I grew up in a &#039;traditional&#039; family, therefore I have to deny gays and lesbians the right to marry and have children&quot;? 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s based on a rational resistance to change&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
That&#039;s not rational.  That&#039;s just being contrary. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s based on what their parents taught them about marriage and procreation&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
That&#039;s also not rational.  Blindly doing something because your parents said so is about as far away from rational as it gets, really. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s a dislike of the public displays of sexual obsession displayed in gay events&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Oh, here we go--&quot;homosexuality is icky!&quot;  Yes, that&#039;s certainly a rational reason to deprive gays of equal rights. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s a review of the literature that suggests that homosexuality is environmentally caused&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Such as? 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s based on the personal experience of successfully resisting homosexual urges&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
Note: &quot;successfully resisting homosexual urges&quot; doesn&#039;t mean they&#039;ve gone away or that you&#039;re no longer gay.  It just means that you&#039;re repressing your own desires and not acting on them.  The fact that this is the best that reparative therapy can manage to do is another point in favor of sexual orientation being immutable. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;it&#8217;s because their religion teaches them that homosexuality is wrong&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
See my remark about parents, above. 
 
&lt;blockquote&gt;Yeah, you guys are sooooo smart.&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
That&#039;s about the only sensible thing you&#039;ve said. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Many of us well-educated agnostics quite rationally believe that the definition of marriage should not be changed.</p></blockquote>
<p>Well, let&#039;s see what your &quot;quite rational&quot; rationales are. </p>
<blockquote><p>we think that children have a right to know and live with their biological parents</p></blockquote>
<p>Which is why those same people are also against divorce and remarrying, adoption, foster homes, artificial insemination, and surrogate mothers for opposite-sex couples, right? </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s a matter of common sense that men and women are designed to be together and procreate</p></blockquote>
<p>Hence infertile opposite-sex couples aren&#039;t allowed to marry.  And of course the use of &quot;common sense&quot; in lieu of facts, studies, well-reasoned arguments&#8230; yeah!  You&#039;re certainly showing us snobby elites how smart you are. </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s based on personal experience of growing up in a traditional family</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8230; I can&#039;t even figure out the supposed rationale here.  &quot;I grew up in a &#039;traditional&#039; family, therefore I have to deny gays and lesbians the right to marry and have children&quot;? </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s based on a rational resistance to change</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#039;s not rational.  That&#039;s just being contrary. </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s based on what their parents taught them about marriage and procreation</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#039;s also not rational.  Blindly doing something because your parents said so is about as far away from rational as it gets, really. </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s a dislike of the public displays of sexual obsession displayed in gay events</p></blockquote>
<p>Oh, here we go&#8211;&quot;homosexuality is icky!&quot;  Yes, that&#039;s certainly a rational reason to deprive gays of equal rights. </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s a review of the literature that suggests that homosexuality is environmentally caused</p></blockquote>
<p>Such as? </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s based on the personal experience of successfully resisting homosexual urges</p></blockquote>
<p>Note: &quot;successfully resisting homosexual urges&quot; doesn&#039;t mean they&#039;ve gone away or that you&#039;re no longer gay.  It just means that you&#039;re repressing your own desires and not acting on them.  The fact that this is the best that reparative therapy can manage to do is another point in favor of sexual orientation being immutable. </p>
<blockquote><p>it&rsquo;s because their religion teaches them that homosexuality is wrong</p></blockquote>
<p>See my remark about parents, above. </p>
<blockquote><p>Yeah, you guys are sooooo smart.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#039;s about the only sensible thing you&#039;ve said.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard W. Fitch</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206218</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard W. Fitch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 23:18:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206218</guid>
		<description>Yes! Visibility does NOT equal power! </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes! Visibility does NOT equal power!</p>
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		<title>By: Wild Clover</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206217</link>
		<dc:creator>Wild Clover</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 22:03:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206217</guid>
		<description>Then there is also the &quot;to&quot;, &quot;too&quot; problem, the &quot;there, their, and they&#039;re&quot; problem  and affect/effect....all these cause almost physical pain akin to the screeching of nails on a chalkboard to me. I have difficulty taking seriously the arguments of folks who cannot take the time to both learn the proper use of words and to use them correctly. I personally try to use all my (fading) literacy skills when posting, lest I be perceived as an ignorant bozo.  
A local fundie church had on it&#039;s marquee for a week &quot;No God ,No Pease. Know God, Know Pease&quot; . All the message I got from that was that God is the dispenser of pease porridge hot, cold, and nine days old. I don&#039;t think that was the intent. 
In short, grammar natzis do us a service, if the folks being criticized realize that by writing like an ignoramus they harm their own message. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Then there is also the &quot;to&quot;, &quot;too&quot; problem, the &quot;there, their, and they&#039;re&quot; problem  and affect/effect&#8230;.all these cause almost physical pain akin to the screeching of nails on a chalkboard to me. I have difficulty taking seriously the arguments of folks who cannot take the time to both learn the proper use of words and to use them correctly. I personally try to use all my (fading) literacy skills when posting, lest I be perceived as an ignorant bozo.<br />
A local fundie church had on it&#039;s marquee for a week &quot;No God ,No Pease. Know God, Know Pease&quot; . All the message I got from that was that God is the dispenser of pease porridge hot, cold, and nine days old. I don&#039;t think that was the intent.<br />
In short, grammar natzis do us a service, if the folks being criticized realize that by writing like an ignoramus they harm their own message.</p>
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		<title>By: The Prop 8 Trial: Day Ten &#124; BlogHalt.com (Pre-Launch)</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206206</link>
		<dc:creator>The Prop 8 Trial: Day Ten &#124; BlogHalt.com (Pre-Launch)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 20:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206206</guid>
		<description>[...] Kincaid&#039;s summary is here. Brian Leubitz thinks that Miller has been a net loss for the defense so [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Kincaid&#39;s summary is here. Brian Leubitz thinks that Miller has been a net loss for the defense so [...]</p>
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		<title>By: unclesmedley</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206216</link>
		<dc:creator>unclesmedley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:50:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206216</guid>
		<description>I haven&#039;t read them all, and of those I have read, the whiff of antagonism is discernible, but so too is a certain hyper-sensitivity on the other end of the rope.  
 
I lived in SF for almost 20 years. I had a gay business partner, a gay lawyer, countless LGBT friends and acquaintances,  and still, I never fully adjusted to the element in that community that felt that the laws of common sense and proportion don&#039;t apply to them.  
 
10% of the population may very well persuade the other 90%. But they will never succeed in taking control of the agenda, and shouting down those that disagree... 
 
So, stop being so touchy and feeling so entitled. Democracy is a wonderful thing if your patient about it. It&#039;s hard work--&quot;advanced citizenship&quot;--that can be rewarding if you work hard and get lucky, but it is a horror to those in a hurry, and being &quot;right&quot; is simply not enough. It&#039;s a process.  
 
Regards ~ smedley </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#039;t read them all, and of those I have read, the whiff of antagonism is discernible, but so too is a certain hyper-sensitivity on the other end of the rope.  </p>
<p>I lived in SF for almost 20 years. I had a gay business partner, a gay lawyer, countless LGBT friends and acquaintances,  and still, I never fully adjusted to the element in that community that felt that the laws of common sense and proportion don&#039;t apply to them.  </p>
<p>10% of the population may very well persuade the other 90%. But they will never succeed in taking control of the agenda, and shouting down those that disagree&#8230; </p>
<p>So, stop being so touchy and feeling so entitled. Democracy is a wonderful thing if your patient about it. It&#039;s hard work&#8211;&quot;advanced citizenship&quot;&#8211;that can be rewarding if you work hard and get lucky, but it is a horror to those in a hurry, and being &quot;right&quot; is simply not enough. It&#039;s a process.  </p>
<p>Regards ~ smedley</p>
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		<title>By: APOLARITY &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Law and Order</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206203</link>
		<dc:creator>APOLARITY &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Law and Order</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:41:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206203</guid>
		<description>[...] see How a Bad Expert Witness Can Ruin A Case. [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] see How a Bad Expert Witness Can Ruin A Case. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Persnickety</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206215</link>
		<dc:creator>Persnickety</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:09:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206215</guid>
		<description>Thank you so much!!! Your efforts are greatly appreciated. 
 
It hurts every time I read &quot;loose&quot; when &quot;lose&quot; was intended.  
 
Can you work on the it&#039;s problem too? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you so much!!! Your efforts are greatly appreciated. </p>
<p>It hurts every time I read &quot;loose&quot; when &quot;lose&quot; was intended.  </p>
<p>Can you work on the it&#039;s problem too?</p>
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		<title>By: jrw</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206214</link>
		<dc:creator>jrw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 18:20:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206214</guid>
		<description>So, if DADT is ended before SCOTUS rules, will they say we now HAVE power now and rule against us? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, if DADT is ended before SCOTUS rules, will they say we now HAVE power now and rule against us?</p>
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		<title>By: fiona64</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206213</link>
		<dc:creator>fiona64</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 16:48:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206213</guid>
		<description>Well, UncleSmedley ... perhaps if you had read every single thread filled with George&#039;s misogyny and homophobic speech, you would come to a different conclusion. 
 
Love, 
Fiona </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, UncleSmedley &#8230; perhaps if you had read every single thread filled with George&#039;s misogyny and homophobic speech, you would come to a different conclusion. </p>
<p>Love,<br />
Fiona</p>
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		<title>By: Polishing Feces: Pugno does his best spin doctoring &#171; Prop 8 Trial Tracker</title>
		<link>http://www.prop8trialtracker.com/2010/01/25/how-a-bad-expert-witness-can-ruin-a-case/#comment-206197</link>
		<dc:creator>Polishing Feces: Pugno does his best spin doctoring &#171; Prop 8 Trial Tracker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prop8trialtracker.com/?p=1395#comment-206197</guid>
		<description>[...] ability to ignore what happened in the courtroom. Here is the sum total of his comment on Prof. Kenneth Miller:  To show that homosexuals are not politically powerless, Dr. Miller provided “striking” [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ability to ignore what happened in the courtroom. Here is the sum total of his comment on Prof. Kenneth Miller:  To show that homosexuals are not politically powerless, Dr. Miller provided “striking” [...]</p>
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